Re: promoting swos online

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13 years 2 months ago #95552 by Retrieving
They d still wouldn t support it in fear that it d end up being played on the aforementioned unlawful builds of their emulator GGPO and 2DF/Starcade use.

The problem is, we can t play with their emulator online without GGPO or 2DF/Starcade regardless of whether the SWOS drivers get coded or not (they re what Kaillera is for WinUAE) and they won t write any new driver for games which may be played on those 2 online multiplayer platforms because their creators used the emulator without releasing the modded code for the public afterwards.

Thus, once again, we re at a stalemate.

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13 years 2 months ago #95556 by Playaveli
Replied by Playaveli on topic Re: promoting swos online
And what s that:
neosource.1emu.net/forums/index.php?topic=1498.0

(Alternative to kaillera (very beta))

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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #95558 by Retrieving
what strikes me as odd is that these guys required GGPO and 2DF/Starcade creators to release the whole software to the public, netcodes included, and not just the modded emulator versions, which doesn t make sense to me. I could be mistaken but that s how they made it sound.

The problem is that what ultimately sets GGPO and 2DF/Starcade apart, IMHO, are the netcodes and NOT the emu (although the emulator is great).

You can rest assured that f I wrote a netcode as effective as those used by GGPO and 2DF/Starcade as a one-man effort all by myself, I d sure as heck keep it on lock and try to make some money out of it (like the GGPO creator did by selling the rights to Capcom or whatever) since not even huge companies like Codemasters (or Capcom) could do better despite having seemingly unlimited resources and Xbox LIVE (and Playstation Network) infrastructures handling the matchmaking...

These guys were nice enough to couple them up with an existing emu that didn t feature multiplayer online natively to allow people to play hundreds of games on them FOR FREE, yet the emu developers are still salty and hating hard on them...go figure.

Btw, their explaination for wanting the whole code is the following:

The MAME code at least requires there to be no linking (dynamic or static) against closed (non-OS) libs, so in the case of MAME everything has to be open. This prevents the project from being hijacked by people linking in closed platform-locked code. ClientServerMAME/MESS ( 10ghost.blogspot.com/ ) seems to be the only one currently even remotely interested in playing by the rules but sadly due to the number that simply don t bother he ll probably struggled to get a foothold again showing why the other illegal, closed clients only do harm.

Amiga emulation is a mess for similar reasons, the people doing the secure disc dumps are keeping information private, and requiring you to use their DLLs, which isn t good for anybody and again just holds back projects like MESS which aim to be open. Their DLLs can t be used without MESS being tied to a single platform, with non-debuggable code which wouldn t be good for anybody which is why the license disallows it. It s not futureproof, or safe in an archival sense at all which is bad. Thankfully(?) the MESS Amiga emulation isn t good enough in general for people to start making hacked MESS builds with those DLLs.

Hopefully this gives you some insight into why license violators are seriously looked down upon.


uhm, ok.

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13 years 2 months ago #95559 by Retrieving

And what s that:
neosource.1emu.net/forums/index.php?topic=1498.0

(Alternative to kaillera (very beta))


That s another netplay middleware but it s unfinished and developed by just one person and at this rate we ll never realistically get a complete version.

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13 years 2 months ago #95560 by Playaveli
Replied by Playaveli on topic Re: promoting swos online
I guess it would be easier to rewrite / reassemble SWOS for MAME!
That would solve our problem...

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13 years 2 months ago #95561 by Retrieving
yeah probably lol.

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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #96102 by Retrieving
wanna know what s ironic?

As explained above these guys are at war with GGPO and Starcade developers because of alleged licensing issues (although both softwares are 100% free and so is the nFBA emulator) and will go to great lenght to explain why they won t support any community with new drivers no matter what because those apps are breaking the law by implementing their emulator without releasing the source code to the public and they want to prevent people from ending up playing on them, acting all high and mighty as if they were the paladins of the all things right and just in the emulation scene, yet they ve just released a version of their emulator that s tweaked and purposely created to run on HACKED PLAYSTATION 3 s modded with a custom firmware that allows the use of pirated games and homebrew applications (and undetectable online cheating on top of it).

What a bunch of f***ing hypocrites, I m at loss for words. ::) :-X

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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #96120 by HairFU
Replied by HairFU on topic Re: promoting swos online
So it seems they are only make things that they are intressted in for their self and SWOS seems that they are not intressted in.

What abou a new WinUAE Kaillera SWOS Version, that works better with win 7 (but also Vista and XP) and with a better interface and more user friendly interface. Maybe someone could code a new SWOS-Kaillera WinUAE Interface, that starts directly when you press on a button on a website or better a playing online button in start menu (of course you must first install the WinUAE SWOS Version - this version could also integrate a automaticly quick load when you start the game [so that you don t have to wait the intro screen and start directly in the menu, if evryone have the exactly same version, it should work without a problem])? Maybe if a person is able to do that, he could also programm a fix chat system for that, that load up when you press the online playing button (to bad I am not able to do that)?

Hmm, don t know if that would work or if that is possible in any way. But what about a tool (integrated in this new Kaillera SWOS Pack), that automatically search for the best server (for example you are from poland and your opponent are from portugal, then the programm search all known server and look for the best matching) to play.

Here is a little graphic that explain my idea.


The SWOS StarUp screen could look like that

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13 years 2 months ago #96262 by ElMichaJ
Replied by ElMichaJ on topic Re: promoting swos online
interesting product information ..
would be nice to do like hairfus idea ...

but who should code it ^^

to make a chat for a match could be made by website ... i got some idea there for it

Hey Hey Hey .... El Micha J !!!

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13 years 2 months ago - 13 years 2 months ago #96268 by lemonheadiv
Well, Retri sure tried his best to motivate them. Aside from the licensing issue, I noticed that the developers mentioned several times the great amount of work that an Amiga driver would require...

Nice ideas by HairFu and Elmichaj.
If we could find a way to improve the netcode we could also simplify our online pack by getting rid of the server option and rely exclusively on p2p (if I m not mistaken, some emulators support more than 2 simultaneous players in p2p mode).

Also, I don t know if anyone is still using the Switch kaillera client button since the new kailleraclient.dll can be used for both p2p and servers.

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