Re: Do we need special p2p-rules?
15 years 3 weeks ago - 15 years 3 weeks ago #62056
by lemonheadiv
In that case p2p would still be better. For exmaple I play with Ejder in p2p mode with no problems at all, the game is very smooth. Sure it s harder but you can t say it s not swos.
The server option is not realistic in my opinion. You would easily get 150ms on a USA server...that would be almost unplayable and it s not worth trying.
One thing that can help is playing a friendly match before the official ones. It helps you get comfortable with the difference in delay.
Replied by lemonheadiv on topic Re: Do we need special p2p-rules?
If there is more...for example with the USA
i play 1 match on a server here and 1 match on server in USA. Thats better for me , because i can play SWOS in 1 match . The other is no SWOS , same as i would play both with P2P (100ms and 5 frames)
In that case p2p would still be better. For exmaple I play with Ejder in p2p mode with no problems at all, the game is very smooth. Sure it s harder but you can t say it s not swos.
The server option is not realistic in my opinion. You would easily get 150ms on a USA server...that would be almost unplayable and it s not worth trying.
One thing that can help is playing a friendly match before the official ones. It helps you get comfortable with the difference in delay.
15 years 3 weeks ago - 15 years 3 weeks ago #62060
by Bomb
One thing that can help is playing a friendly match before the official ones. It helps you get comfortable with the difference in delay.
[/quote]
good point, if there is no other possibility.. I often did it with daimaou, but not every player has the time or the motivation to do it.
most times it s like: quick, quick we have to hurry
hehe, could that be a rule? : if the delay is higher than 3, both players have to warm up 2 friendly games, if one of both want to.
Replied by Bomb on topic Re: Do we need special p2p-rules?
One thing that can help is playing a friendly match before the official ones. It helps you get comfortable with the difference in delay.
[/quote]
good point, if there is no other possibility.. I often did it with daimaou, but not every player has the time or the motivation to do it.
most times it s like: quick, quick we have to hurry
hehe, could that be a rule? : if the delay is higher than 3, both players have to warm up 2 friendly games, if one of both want to.
15 years 3 weeks ago #62072
by daimaou
Replied by daimaou on topic Re: Do we need special p2p-rules?
Another p2p vs server discussion, been a while 
I agree with what Bomb states, but really this is exactly the same situation for everybody like lemon mentioned it. In fact I think lemon explained it perfectly.
I play vs portuguese players with 1 or 2 skips too. I play with 3/4 skips with everyone else depending on their country. Versus some even 5fps like Ejder sometimes or certain Polish players. Of course you notice the difference, but I adapt to it and I think anybody can as well. This can get more problematic in that specific case of 1 day cups where you have to play with 2 skips in one match and with 4 skips on the next one with no time to adapt so that can be tricky, I totally understand that.
Also just to give my example I probably play more games vs portuguese players than vs players from other countries, so unlike many say I m as used to high pings as most of the players here.... when someone tells me I won a match just because of the ping I hate it. Especially since when most of those players beat me on p2p they don t mention pings at all, they are just better.
When I play on server I m in huge disavantage as my pings on arena are around 90ms where versus most of german players I get 3 skips only on p2p for example. Also lets face it p2p is a really superior protocol than the kaillera one, there is usually no slowdown at all on p2p even with high pings (I can play smoothly vs someone in Brazil even though with extremely high pings) and almost no desyncs. Only advantage in Kaillera is the multiplayer support. I remember sometime ago I tried to play a FLOT with lobo and xflea on server and we got frustated with so many desyncs, it s something I rarely have to deal with on p2p and wasn t used to it anymore.
p2p is fair since conditions are the same for both, obviously as long as the game is still playable. I think we can play ok with 4 skips, not the best conditions sure, but after a bit I get used to the delay, you can t say it s not swos anymore. More than that is where I feel the game really starts getting random with lot of mistakes due to bad timings.
As far as servers, there are no good servers for swos rather than arena and swos.info afaik so all players closer to them will always have better pings there. For me this situation is simple if I m forced by rules on playing my games on server it will be the end of online swos competitions for me since I just can t play there. This is a hard subject and I think there would be no simple rules to deal with it.
Online gaming is completely different than offline and maybe in some years we can get really low latencies all over the world, but so far this is something that is present and I think p2p is the most fair method of dealing with it.
Versus me if anyone is not confortable with the pings I m always ok with playing a friendly before the match to help getting used to the delay. If we have more than 4 skips I m the first to ask if it wouldn t be better to play another time.
I agree with what Bomb states, but really this is exactly the same situation for everybody like lemon mentioned it. In fact I think lemon explained it perfectly.
I play vs portuguese players with 1 or 2 skips too. I play with 3/4 skips with everyone else depending on their country. Versus some even 5fps like Ejder sometimes or certain Polish players. Of course you notice the difference, but I adapt to it and I think anybody can as well. This can get more problematic in that specific case of 1 day cups where you have to play with 2 skips in one match and with 4 skips on the next one with no time to adapt so that can be tricky, I totally understand that.
Also just to give my example I probably play more games vs portuguese players than vs players from other countries, so unlike many say I m as used to high pings as most of the players here.... when someone tells me I won a match just because of the ping I hate it. Especially since when most of those players beat me on p2p they don t mention pings at all, they are just better.
When I play on server I m in huge disavantage as my pings on arena are around 90ms where versus most of german players I get 3 skips only on p2p for example. Also lets face it p2p is a really superior protocol than the kaillera one, there is usually no slowdown at all on p2p even with high pings (I can play smoothly vs someone in Brazil even though with extremely high pings) and almost no desyncs. Only advantage in Kaillera is the multiplayer support. I remember sometime ago I tried to play a FLOT with lobo and xflea on server and we got frustated with so many desyncs, it s something I rarely have to deal with on p2p and wasn t used to it anymore.
p2p is fair since conditions are the same for both, obviously as long as the game is still playable. I think we can play ok with 4 skips, not the best conditions sure, but after a bit I get used to the delay, you can t say it s not swos anymore. More than that is where I feel the game really starts getting random with lot of mistakes due to bad timings.
As far as servers, there are no good servers for swos rather than arena and swos.info afaik so all players closer to them will always have better pings there. For me this situation is simple if I m forced by rules on playing my games on server it will be the end of online swos competitions for me since I just can t play there. This is a hard subject and I think there would be no simple rules to deal with it.
Online gaming is completely different than offline and maybe in some years we can get really low latencies all over the world, but so far this is something that is present and I think p2p is the most fair method of dealing with it.
Versus me if anyone is not confortable with the pings I m always ok with playing a friendly before the match to help getting used to the delay. If we have more than 4 skips I m the first to ask if it wouldn t be better to play another time.
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