Retro update 1984/85

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2 weeks 1 day ago - 2 weeks 11 hours ago #144285 by DaniSwos
A crazy proposal for nostalgic ones.
All update-efforts are done with nowadays in mind.
But what about making an ultimate retro update, for instance for the season 1984-85 ?
Italian Serie A would be incredible: Juventus with Platini, Napoli with Maradona, Udinese with Zico, Inter with Rummenigge and so on.
Not to forget a young Van Basten at Ajax, and Gullit at Feyenoord!

The players back to 1984 could be retrieved for example from the following sources:

- www.historical-lineups.com/
- www.worldfootball.net/competition/eng-premier-league-1984-1985/
- calcio-seriea.net/risultati/1984/1722/
- www.bdfutbol.com/en/t/t1984-85.html

That said, some suggestions follow.

Since back to 1984 some Swos leagues did not exist (Croatia, Estonia, Lithuania, Slovakia, Ukraine, etc.), the following "changes" could be done (the exact meaning of #EMPTY is provided below):

- Belarus 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Croatia 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Latvia 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Lituania 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Slovenia 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Slovakia 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Ukraine 96/97 --> #EMPTY
- Russia 96/97 --> USSR 83/84
- Czech 96/97 --> Czechoslovakia 83/84
- Estonia 96/97 --> East Germany 83/84

Since it is not possible to remove slots allocated to leagues, #EMPTY league means the following:
- The name of the league is replaced with something like "######"; so in Career is easy to see that the league actually "does not exist"
- All the teams are replaced with a team named "X" with home/away kits all grey
- All the players are replaced with a player named "X" with all skils equal to 0
- All the coaches are replaced with a coach named "X"
- The league must not be considered for qualifications to the three european cups, the first year ( www.swoes.info/champions_league_info/ ) as well as all the following years in a Career (how it works: www.swoes.info/teams_qualifies/ )

So, basically "EMPTY" leagues will be played by anonymous "X" teams with awful anonymous "X" players without affecting any european cups. Everything would still work fine since the total number of "real" european leagues would be 43 - 7 = 36, more than enough to get the 32 teams needed for the Cup-Winners Cup

To quickly match team strengths back to 1983/84 before editing the players in details, the following swaps could be considered:

- Manchester Utd <--> Liverpool
- Aston Villa <--> Everton
- AC Milan <-> Roma
- Parma <-> Internazionale
- Lazio <-> Verona
- Bor.Dortmund <-> Hamburg
- Dep. la Coruna <-> Atletic Bilbao
- Paris SG <-> Bordeaux
Last edit: 2 weeks 11 hours ago by DaniSwos.
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2 weeks 1 day ago #144286 by Playaveli
Replied by Playaveli on topic Retro update 1984/85
This is such a cool idea! Let's see if some people are willing to jump in and contribute editing team files for this.

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2 weeks 1 day ago #144287 by peppecapello
Replied by peppecapello on topic Retro update 1984/85
I am ready to make my contribution.

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2 weeks 1 day ago #144289 by Gorzo
Replied by Gorzo on topic Retro update 1984/85
hey DaniSwos,
interesting idea for retro files :) I have some ideas for pts general of a given team/league etc. The transfermarkt website will also help us choose players from better leagues do team setup :) we do not have to leave empty slots :) we break the USSR and Yugoslavia into today's leagues :) Croatia, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia etc. may stay :) we will create from Czechoslovakia leagues the Czech Republic and Slovakia :) we will make Germany as West Germany and San Marino as East Germany :) we will only change the number of teams in the file, e.g. Albania league only 8 teams, Croatia 8 teams, Lithuania 8 teams, Ukraine 8 teams etc. we will remove the remaining unnecessary teams then we will check with Playaveli if the game will not crash :) but the most important in my opinion are people :) it's a project for a few months :) I think we need 10-15 peoples :) we will do the retro channel on discord if the project start :) btw why exactly 84/85? :)
cheers :)
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2 weeks 14 hours ago #144290 by DaniSwos
Replied by DaniSwos on topic Retro update 1984/85
Update:

I found another really interesting site with all historical rosters:
Example with Real Madrid 1984/85:

www.national-football-teams.com/club/231...4_1/Real_Madrid.html

The site is particularly useful because it lists not only players, appearances and goals, but also in particular the precise positions (right midfielder, left back, and so on).
Parsing the html could be also a way to quickly obtain a database for the update !

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2 weeks 14 hours ago - 2 weeks 12 hours ago #144291 by DaniSwos
Replied by DaniSwos on topic Retro update 1984/85
Hi Gorzo, thanks for the reply!
Leaving all the exiting leagues is also a good idea, but I thought removing them and introducing USSR, Czechoslovakia and so on would have been more realistic!
Besides, replacing unexisting leagues with "empty" ones would require to search and add less teams and players.

I am not sure if removing teams is possible or so easy; it can break the national cups. For instance, as far as I know, italian national cup ("coppa italia") may search for some non-league teams; so if they are removed, italian cup would crash after the first season. Unfortunately I do not know exactly how to modify national cups (I found in the exe some code which could be the format, but no idea where is the code to *select* the teams for each cup).
Last edit: 2 weeks 12 hours ago by DaniSwos.

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2 weeks 13 hours ago #144294 by Playaveli
Replied by Playaveli on topic Retro update 1984/85
Maybe I can help you guys. For the "unimportant" leagues... we can just add fantasy teams, made up names like TRAIL RES players.
Hassling with removing teams etc... do not do that! ;)
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2 weeks 12 hours ago - 2 weeks 12 hours ago #144295 by Gorzo
Replied by Gorzo on topic Retro update 1984/85

Playaveli wrote: Maybe I can help you guys. For the "unimportant" leagues... we can just add fantasy teams, made up names like TRAIL RES players.
Hassling with removing teams etc... do not do that! ;)


okay, I have a better idea, especially for teams from weaker leagues we choose from 6-10 teams, e.g. other teams to non-league, if we cannot be removed and the statistics are ready :D we will be based on prices from the season 96/97 or from the database 95/96 haha we'll just add real players from those year or we will come up with :P
Last edit: 2 weeks 12 hours ago by Gorzo.

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2 weeks 11 hours ago #144296 by DaniSwos
Replied by DaniSwos on topic Retro update 1984/85
Moving teams to "other leagues" does not help, since you have to consider also the national CUPS, which will anyhow pick up also those teams you moved to other leagues.
And as far as I know, reducing the number of cup rounds will make the game to crash after the first season.

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2 weeks 11 hours ago - 2 weeks 9 hours ago #144297 by Playaveli
Replied by Playaveli on topic Retro update 1984/85
I think the best way is:
- edit the big leagues from which data is easily available.
- Get organized and assign editors to those leagues (open a google drive sheet!)
- We can easily adjust league sizes to match 84/85 reality (SWOS 2020 executable can handle it)

- Fill up the other leagues (for which only insufficient or no data is found on the internet) with fantasy names that are compiled from "First name" + "Last name" of random players.
- (I have a complete fantasy database at hand, ready to use. Prices and skills match 96/97 structure and player names in each country seem realistic.)

That way, career mode will work without problems.
Last edit: 2 weeks 9 hours ago by Playaveli.

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